OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

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Madison
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OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by Madison » Thu Sep 13, 2018 8:17 pm

Created this for Marcus (UK) to open up discussion.

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by mignered » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:45 pm

My proposal would be to have an overall commander for each side.
This person will allocate supply and troop distributions for Fronts and Panzer Armies. Four on a side will work if Forgotten Battles is in play. So that would translate to 10 gamers.

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by TEJ » Wed Sep 19, 2018 1:59 am

I am considering adult OCS this year for the first time and have a few questions:

- are we thinking of two games if there are enough players?

- in the past, there's been talk of playing both the 'southern' and 'northern' sections of the East Front together...and the 'northern' sector has been left un-played because it wasn't going to be fun...how is this different? (I think this has to do with not allocating useful amounts of replacements and supplies to, and stealing better formations from, "quiet" sectors in favor of the more open, 'southern' sectors.)

- how will the table setup be if the front is something north of Moscow all the way to the Sea of Azov? Will we be able to reach the middle without back troubles?

- what was played last year and the year before? It didn't look the same both years but perhaps I am mis-remembering.

- if 3d Winter is a playtest, will linking it with the 'northern' sectors be good for the playtest, or bad, or irrelevant? Will the playtest be impacted if teams can and do shift forces among sectors? If we can't shift forces between games, then why bother to play them together?

- what optional rules would be in use?

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by Ardwulf » Wed Sep 19, 2018 2:17 pm

TEJ wrote:- are we thinking of two games if there are enough players?
One big game, linked.
TEJ wrote:- in the past, there's been talk of playing both the 'southern' and 'northern' sections of the East Front together...and the 'northern' sector has been left un-played because it wasn't going to be fun...how is this different? (I think this has to do with not allocating useful amounts of replacements and supplies to, and stealing better formations from, "quiet" sectors in favor of the more open, 'southern' sectors.)
This danger isn't unique to this particular game(s). Dunno if there's any rules enforing where the effort goes... but it would make sense if there was. The Third Winter Soviet Offensive/Defensive stance mechanic, if applied to the whole thing and combined with correct tuning of geographic objectives, would basically take care of the problem.
TEJ wrote:- how will the table setup be if the front is something north of Moscow all the way to the Sea of Azov? Will we be able to reach the middle without back troubles?
It would be best to split the tables. The two things together would be the size of eight regular 23x34 maps.
TEJ wrote:- what was played last year and the year before? It didn't look the same both years but perhaps I am mis-remembering.
Last year was Third Winter. Not sure what went on the year before, as last year was my first year.
TEJ wrote:- if 3d Winter is a playtest, will linking it with the 'northern' sectors be good for the playtest, or bad, or irrelevant? Will the playtest be impacted if teams can and do shift forces among sectors? If we can't shift forces between games, then why bother to play them together?
From what we gather, Tony (the designer) explicitly wants these two games to be linkable. So even if there would be no value in such an excercise for the individual games themselves, there'd be playtest value in the combined effort.

I would be very surprised if there was no ability to shift forces between sectors.
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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by marcus » Sun Nov 04, 2018 3:22 pm

The Third Winter and The Forgotten Battles are to be sold as two single games and both have their own victory conditions...however Tony will issue a set of linking rules so that they can be played together meaning that if you want you can within the rules transfer nearly any units you have to either map...…………………….the choice is yours...……………the Rumanian and Hungarian units do have strict limits regarding their movements on their respective maps. With about 5.000 counter in the two games this will need lots of thought as to gaining the victory conditions on the separate maps...………………..with the later addition of the third game called The Hero City which includes the Leningrad, Volkov fortified front the Northern Finnish front plus the Oraniebaum Bridgehead and the fortified Luga and Narva lines this could add a further 1500 units to the set...…………………….lots for us to play with...………...happy gaming lads.

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by Tony » Sun Nov 04, 2018 11:09 pm

Well well, here I am!

Right guys, as Marcus my advance party says, I hope to bring TTW with latest pre pub maps. TFB with mate maps to TTW, plus the 16Th army from AGN upto lake ilmen, taman / Crimea module. .....and maybe an initial outing of The Hero city.

However, I say hope , as I am flying to Cape Town the following week but all should fall into place.

The maps break easily north to south, this one very very long front and easy to reach . Marcus, mark and 8 are playtesting this coming weekend, the designs to date....hope this helps .....

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by Ardwulf » Mon Nov 05, 2018 2:31 pm

Holy cow. That's gonna need a big table.
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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by marcus » Mon Nov 05, 2018 10:33 pm

Or maybe 3 separate tables split as per game...…………………...I think that could be best.

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by Tony » Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:43 pm

No , that created more problems at Tempe than it solved. The game is designed to be played as one. The western most maps will be where the split is . This will allow all to reach from both sides and present a continuous front of 5-6 OCS maps north to south.

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Re: OCS Third Winter/Forgotten Battles

Post by TEJ » Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:17 am

For what I'm worth in OCS, I'm still considering this for my main game. Pity the side that gets my "help." :D

I saw one answer above on this question but it was speculative and clearly not from the cold end of the Gulf Stream, so I'll ask again (understanding that our British friends don't have the Winterfest history to speak for past events):

In the past, there's been talk of playing both the 'southern' and 'northern' sections of the East Front together in OCS. The 'northern' sector has always been left un-played because it wasn't going to be fun. "Anyone who says we should include it is de facto volunteering to play up there" was a memorable reply. How is this different?

I think this has to do with not allocating useful amounts of replacements and supplies to, and stealing better formations from, "quiet" sectors in favor of the more open, 'southern' sectors. It may also have to do with whether the games even have much in the way of air, armor, or artillery up there, or whether it's just a mass of low-quality Soviet infantry facing deeply entrenched Germans in implausibly high strength with a few mech units as local reserves...so that no breakthrough is plausible on either side.

What's the key to Forgotten Battles not having been forgotten for a very good reason?

Todd

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